Hacker Newsnew | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submitlogin

True but:

When the next round of layoffs come Alice is the least needed, so unless she is good at making sure everyone knows she gets the best solutions, she's likely to get canned.

Then when they apply at the new job at the local starup Alice is surely going to fail the first round programming quiz.



You are making the fallacious assumption that this is the one and only thing that Alice has ever done, because it's the one thing that we've talked about, and it is therefore the one thing under the metaphorical lamp post that you're thinking about.

If this is a pattern that recurs over weeks, months, and years, the delta in results between Alice and even Bob, let alone Clyde, only opens wider. Alice will surely have other opportunities to do "real programming". Granted, the way Alice is doing it may not be immediately impressive on its own but if it has someone else to compare against it becomes more evident.

I can say I've seen the Clyde solution before, but cpdean's story is rather optimistic. In the real world, the Clyde solution actually delivers late, is usually badly bodged together under the hood due to the too-late recognition of the impending deadline, and will actually create an ongoing maintenance nightmare as his code will be buggy and yet not perform very well no matter how much he bangs on it. In the real world, this sometimes gets combined with a bad manager who sees Clyde engaging in heroics and thinks Clyde is dedicated and stuff, but this is far from a sure thing. That's a very specific kind of bad manager and Clyde would be well advised not to count on having that exact kind of manager. (Heck, I've been Clyde. Very educational. Terrible use of resources.)


>Heck, I've been Clyde. Very educational. Terrible use of resources.

Agreed. So looking back are you happy you took Clyde's path? If you had to advise a new grad today, what would you recommend?


Do the Alice thing, leave early, and do useless programming puzzles for several hours in the afternoon?


Do the Alice thing, leave early

Ha! First you have to find a company where the reward for finishing early isn't more work.


Well, in that case, just look busy in your cube.


That's an awfully pessimistic view, and assumes that she is the only one that sees the value in this situation. Also, nowhere was the assertion made that Alice was not a competent programmer that couldn't pass a test, merely that she used her time more wisely in this situation.


I'm starting to wonder if we would be having this same conversation if we substituted the name "Alice" for "John."


This may have hit the nail on the head: nobody is arguing about Bob and Clyde.


Hopefully by then someone will notice Alice should be a team lead or manager due to her pragmatic and customer focused nature.


yeah, that's taking away a pragmatic developer from what she does best.


The goal being Alice will transmit her methods and habits to the entire team.


I think that will be wrong too. A good team lives from a variety of experiences and abilities. The trick is to find the right team member for the job.


Why does everyone assume that Alice just sat on her ass the whole time? That she doesn't know how to program just because she knew she had better things to do than bring yet another half-assed CMS into the world?




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: